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Jan 11, 2017

Interesting Psak: proposal for marriage is not marriage

Wedding proposals happen all the time, including in the frum world. The classic proposal has the guy getting down on one knee, asking, "Will you marry me?" and then, often, offering forth a diamond ring. Sometimes the story goes down a little differently, but mor eor less that is generally how it works.

So, a guy proposes to a gal he has been dating, and she says yes and accepts the diamond ring. They make plans to marry, and eventually the day comes and they don't get married. They broke it off.

A friend told the former-bride that it seems she might have been considered married and might need a get - a guy asked will you marry me and gave a ring. Witnesses were present. That is marriage. You now need a get. So says the friend. She freaks out - sounds like a reasonable explanation, as it does sound exactly like a marriage, just without the chuppa.

Former-bride runs to the beis din in Ashqelon and explains the problem.

Let's not forget, this problem exists in almost every wedding proposal ever. Anybody who breaks off an engagement might be subject to the answer of this court.

The beis din debated the issue and agreed it is similar to a wedding, however.... however, it is only a proposal and is understood to be only a proposal for a marriage at a future time. Also, the ring given was not the smooth, unadorned, ring of a wedding, but was a diamond ring. They decided she does not need a get.

However, the beis din did come out to warn the public to be careful and not stop this custom of proposals that are similar to actual marriages. They said to not give a ring at the time of the proposal. They actually added a funny point - they said, "people should refrain from the custom of marriage proposals with the giving of a ring from his hand to her hand, both because of the laws of nidda that prohibit touching between a man and a woman, and because under certain conditions it could God forbid cause a terrible stumbling block of adultery and mamzeirus afterwards.."

To digress, I dont know why they had to add the nidda part. There is no issur nidda in handing things form a man to a woman. There is an issur of touching, but handing something does not have to include touching, and men hand women things all the time. Some people choose to avoid doing so, but that is very different than saying it is assur to hand things to a woman.

Back to the point, the beis din says to change the customary marriage proposal so it won't be similar to an actual wedding.

And dont say you weren't warned.

source: Srugim





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2 comments:

  1. Simple solution: propose in private, without witnesses. That's what I did.

    ReplyDelete
  2. it seems very weird to me but nowadays the trend seems to be to propose with friends present including one who videos and photographs the proposal

    ReplyDelete

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